This Old Neon Forum

Welcome to the #BGE2020 Elimination Round of 32!

Each game is seeded based on its performance in the two opening rounds of pools. Every game in the Upper Bracket has defeated multiple other games in 1-on-1 polls to get to this point. These are still the best of the best.

Polls are updated weekly, typically on Monday. Check back throughout the week to make sure you don't miss a vote!

HOW TO VOTE

This is easy. You only get one vote per poll. The game with the most votes wins. In the event of a tie, the higher seed advances, so don't get complacent!

This is looking like a bit of an upset so far.

I think Ultima IV's flipping the script on the standard RPG flow still makes it stand out. While most modern AAA RPGs are over here with just paragon/renegade style dialogues or at best faction affinities or reputations, you really have to walk the walk in Ultima and it doesn't hold your hand doing it.

Mario Galaxy is a refinement, but it seems like the peak of the series to me. Is the best Ultima better than the best Mario? In the abstract I think U4 is more important and more interesting, but I still feel like I have to think about whether it's the best game ever.

Niahak wrote: ↑05 Feb 2024 20:41 This is looking like a bit of an upset so far.

I think Ultima IV's flipping the script on the standard RPG flow still makes it stand out. While most modern AAA RPGs are over here with just paragon/renegade style dialogues or at best faction affinities or reputations, you really have to walk the walk in Ultima and it doesn't hold your hand doing it.

Mario Galaxy is a refinement, but it seems like the peak of the series to me. Is the best Ultima better than the best Mario? In the abstract I think U4 is more important and more interesting, but I still feel like I have to think about whether it's the best game ever.

The central "gimmick" (which I really shouldn't call it) or core idea and organizing philosophy of Ultima IV is not just a great idea (make an RPG that's not just about walking around and killing bad guys till you kill the biggest bad guy and save the world), but it's also executed really well, in a really interesting way. It's a good, fun RPG where you do different stuff than what we're used to doing in an RPG, and it works! For all our talk about influence in here, it's insane to me that more games haven't copied Ultima IV more directly... I guess because it's really hard to come up with and execute on a great idea.

Galaxy is great for sure. It has problems inherent to 3D platformers in general, but it plays with those problems with its Galaxy gravity space design to great effect. But I still prefer Super Mario World. And Galaxy 2 is arguably a better game, even though I weigh originality and influence higher than slight sequel refinements. There are opponents against which I'd vote for Galaxy. But Ultima IV isn't one of them.

Kong Wen wrote: ↑05 Feb 2024 20:50 The central "gimmick" (which I really shouldn't call it) or core idea and organizing philosophy of Ultima IV is not just a great idea (make an RPG that's not just about walking around and killing bad guys till you kill the biggest bad guy and save the world), but it's also executed really well, in a really interesting way. It's a good, fun RPG where you do different stuff than what we're used to doing in an RPG, and it works! For all our talk about influence in here, it's insane to me that more games haven't copied Ultima IV more directly... I guess because it's really hard to come up with and execute on a great idea.

I think some of the interfaces in RPGs are different now, too. Having to actually type in the number when the blind reagent seller asks you for money is way different from a binary choice. It lets you do interesting things... like giving MORE than was asked for, which IIRC gives you compassion points but takes away honesty ones.

The dialogue system being fully text entry based (I think there were some hints dropped in base dialogue, but I might be misremembering) meant keeping copious notes was important. I don't think that would fly as well nowadays, even in games where memo options exist I personally don't use them.

I don't remember much of the game anymore, honestly - I'm way due for a replay, but that's true of many of the top 32!